Curse

Nurse With Wound · Oct 24, 2006, 09:33 PM // 21:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by crucifix

lots of bullshit.

Hey, Riptide, why do you waste your time fighting with this dude. Everyone knows that his guild was running barrageway all the time, one of the most brainless and lame build ever made, and its obvious he has no idea how it is to monk in Ha / and or gvg. As he said himself " was doing orders" Just let it go

To op, read all the other advices, among the flaming posts there were few really good pointers.

cerb · Oct 24, 2006, 09:49 PM // 21:49

Crucifix, stop arguing. Being a good monk is definately hard than many other professions (namely necro). You have to deal with all that pressure from mesmers, warriors, rangers, assassins, etc. while you usually don't when playing something else.

Of course, being good at anything does require skill and practice, but monk, out of all other professions, is the class that has to go through most pressure, so it's not all about knowing when to heal, when to prot someone, but also how to be effective while being pressured.

I'm totally not saying monk is the hardest class to play, I'm just saying it is definately not one of the easiest.

If you compare the experience of the average player from PrPr with the average player from sOap, or the frequency in which both guilds win halls, I would, hands down, say that Alz has a lot more experience and knows much more than you.

Bacon Goes Monk · Oct 24, 2006, 10:03 PM // 22:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheOneMephisto

Good monks don't need party windows, those are just a little extra thing to help them out a bit and to help them know exactly how much they need to heal.

Good monks preprot, watch positioning, notice caster raising arms or warriors converging, notice shadow steps, watch energy, keep tabs on others energy (specifically other monks), make notes of major opponent offensive threats, watch skill animations and casting animations, kite, top off health, and do many other millions of things that any PuG would take for granted.

Bad monks run from warriors and press buttons to make red bars go up.

All that is only partially true. The second paragraph is correct, the first is not.

Let's say you're infusing. You keep a spiker targeted to see an incoming spike. You see them begin the spike, but the way they face could be one of two or three people. How are you going to target the person being spiked without a party window?

Let's say you're playing vs heavy hex. Most of your teamates have a hex on them, and one of your eles needs a hex off. You're going to search around for the ele who needs attention, while someone else is getting beat on by a warrior? Do you realize how much time that would need?

If a good monk didn't use a party window, how are they going to find people needing a fast heal before he dies?

Bad monks run from warriors...? You mean kite? You say good monks kite in the first paragraph, then say bad monks kite in the last sentence... Since when was kiting bad?

crucifix · Oct 24, 2006, 10:59 PM // 22:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nurse With Wound

Hey, Riptide, why do you waste your time fighting with this dude. Everyone knows that his guild was running barrageway all the time, one of the most brainless and lame build ever made, and its obvious he has no idea how it is to monk in Ha / and or gvg. As he said himself " was doing orders" Just let it go

To op, read all the other advices, among the flaming posts there were few really good pointers.

i was insulting pve kids with the topk comment. I do monk on occasion in HA. it isnt difficult, as i said before, just not pleasent.

and yes, we ran barrageway in HA, why the hell not? can you really insult a gimmick build in a gimmick environment?

Mental Leteci · Oct 24, 2006, 11:10 PM // 23:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by crucifix

can you really insult a gimmick build in a gimmick environment?

Didn't he just do that?

Thom Bangalter · Oct 25, 2006, 12:38 AM // 00:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bacon Goes Monk

All that is only partially true. The second paragraph is correct, the first is not.

Let's say you're infusing. You keep a spiker targeted to see an incoming spike. You see them begin the spike, but the way they face could be one of two or three people. How are you going to target the person being spiked without a party window?

Let's say you're playing vs heavy hex. Most of your teamates have a hex on them, and one of your eles needs a hex off. You're going to search around for the ele who needs attention, while someone else is getting beat on by a warrior? Do you realize how much time that would need?

If a good monk didn't use a party window, how are they going to find people needing a fast heal before he dies?

Bad monks run from warriors...? You mean kite? You say good monks kite in the first paragraph, then say bad monks kite in the last sentence... Since when was kiting bad?

You mean you don't have party members hotkeyed somewhere? Even I have them hotkeyed and I don't monk.

Dodo The Extinct · Oct 25, 2006, 01:24 AM // 01:24

Hotkeys are not crucial. Of course, when you are facing a spike group, they make a big difference, but when you are facing pressure, its not a huge deal imo.

Bacon Goes Monk · Oct 25, 2006, 02:43 AM // 02:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thom Bangalter

You mean you don't have party members hotkeyed somewhere? Even I have them hotkeyed and I don't monk.

Hotkeys have nothing to do with that. How are you going to monk efficiently without a party window? Would you rather listen to people calling out their number when they're taking damage, instead of simply looking at the bar?

And no, I don't use hotkeys for party members. My reflexes are fast enough to click on the person instead of using the keys.

Thom Bangalter · Oct 25, 2006, 02:52 AM // 02:52

Well, obviously you need party windows to get an idea of who has priority, but it shouldn't be your only aid.

I'm just playing devil's advocate though. Party windows are INCREDIBLY helpful, without them I wouldn't know when to spam hp.

apocalypse_xx · Oct 25, 2006, 02:55 AM // 02:55

To bring this thread back on topic and to try and provide some help to the OP...this IMO is the problem with introducing 6vs6 in HA. Yes, even when HA was 8vs8, the monk backline was still almost always the same bars, but there still was a little more room for trying new skills, now, with only 2 monks, the bars that most leaders ask for are set in stone because they have been proven to be the most effective and dealing with 95% of the situations you may encounter. I stated this before and will state it again...limiting teams to 6 players removes options, plain and simple, that is why teams are not willing to be flexible with some of the classes in HA now.

Hope this helped to explain why teams ask for certain bars.

Vax · Oct 25, 2006, 05:11 AM // 05:11

RC
Restore Condition
Gift of Health
Reversal of Fortune
Guardian
Signet of Devotion/Infuse Health (depends on the other monk in the group)
Spirit Bond/Prot Spirit
Inspired Hex
Channeling

Blessed Light
Blessed Light
Gift of Health
Reversal of Fortune
Guardian
Signet of Devotion/Infuse Health (depends on the other monk in the group)
Spirit Bond/Prot Spirit
Inspired Hex
Channeling

WoH
Orision of Healing
Dwaynas Kiss
Word of Healing
Healing Seed
Infuse Health/Healing Touch (depends on what the other monk in the group is using)
Inspired Hex
Channeling

Mo/Me
Energy Drain
RoF
Guardian
Divine Boon
Signet of Devotion
Protective Spirit/Spirit Bond
Inspired Hex
Channeling

------
There ya go

Those are the only monks that you will ever really see in HA right now.. Until Anet decides to change HA back to seven man you wont see anything else
Holy Veil

------
A monks no no's are to basically not to:
Stand still while warrior or anything for that matter is attacking you
To let someone die
To use infuse health if you are being attacked
------
thats honestly about it
there isnt much to healing but just to deal with the pressure that the other team is dishing out.. which i cant do because i crumble under the pressure of other teams no matter what.. which is one reason why I never monk

anyway you should start out in RA or TA before you move onto HA just because of the fact that it is much easier to monk in RA or TA than it is to in HA or GVG

Thom Bangalter · Oct 25, 2006, 05:14 AM // 05:14

RA monking is easy because everyone that plays there is bad.

TA monking is arguably more difficult than HA because you don't have another monk to pick up your slack, and other teams often have a whole character dedicated to shutting you down.

Legendary Shiz · Oct 25, 2006, 05:51 PM // 17:51

I agree 100% that TA monking is harder than HA monking. In TA it's you supporting everybody, in HA you will have another monk...sometimes two. Not to mention other support characters, like a warder for example.

martialis · Oct 30, 2006, 09:28 PM // 21:28

Wow, can you feel the hate?

The reason Life sheath is not used is because it is - a healing spell, and a weaker version of the healing prayers spells, like WoH. They cancel the same amount of damage, but WoH is slightly more effective and can't be stripped or shattered. Life sheath is wonderful if you're really lagging or really lazy, but otherwise, it's just a tiny bit inferior, so that's why it's not used.

Shield of Deflection is god, as I'm sure you know, but you can only keep it on once person at a time, you can't do anything else meanwhile, and it casts relatively slow, so that's the problem with that. Shield of Regeneration is mixed up; the armour helps against warriors, etc., but the regen does nothing to help against focused fire.

In comparison to Life Sheath, Infuse Health is not a healing spell. It's a stronger version of RoF, and should be used to protect people. You can practice using it for that, and it's pretty clear when it should be used. The reason it's on the WoH healer, of course, is because it is in Healing Prayers.

I hope that makes sense. Most people here know what they're talking about, but they type a lot of crap to insult each other, and I would ignore most of it.

Mental Leteci · Oct 30, 2006, 10:49 PM // 22:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by martialis

I hope that makes sense. Most people here know what they're talking about, but they type a lot of crap to insult each other, and I would ignore most of it.

After reading your post 3 times i realized that the only person who doesn't know what he's talking about is you.

A User Name · Oct 30, 2006, 11:16 PM // 23:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thom Bangalter

RA monking is easy because everyone that plays there is bad.

TA monking is arguably more difficult than HA because you don't have another monk to pick up your slack, and other teams often have a whole character dedicated to shutting you down.

So I'm a bad player because I play in RA when I'm bored and no GvG is going on? Also, while as a general statement TA monking is harder than RA and HA (but i cant really say anything about HA since I haven't monked there in a while), I have seen some awesome combinations in RA that make monking in TA look easy. But it is all circumstancal. =P

Anyway to back on topic, and @ OP most ppl in HA simply dont like change until its been proven to work (general statement) or it is simply the most effective healing/protecting/whatever there is and unless you have the friends that are willing to try new stuff you are basically stuck with the standard builds. Anyway that's my opinion alone.

Legendary Shiz · Oct 30, 2006, 11:31 PM // 23:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thom Bangalter

Well, obviously you need party windows to get an idea of who has priority, but it shouldn't be your only aid.

I'm just playing devil's advocate though. Party windows are INCREDIBLY helpful, without them I wouldn't know when to spam hp.

haha, am I the only one who found that last part insanely funny?

He never said you were a bad player because you did RA. You just need to realize that RA monking isn't really anything to brag about. Basically most people could be a succesful monk in RA. It doesn't make you a bad player monking in RA, but it certainly doesn't make you anything of a good player.

And Cruc, I don't really know how you can say monking is easy. It is, IMO the hardest class to play. I also think eles are very hard, especially for people that don't have a clue how to play them. Exhaustion is killer. But monking is difficult IMO, because you have a low armor level, you usually will have a war/sin or some sort of monk hate on you at all times, and you have to not only just heal but all the things mentioned in this thread. Watch your position, preprot, yadda yadda yadda. I could agree 100% that monking isn't an overly hard thing if it was simply just standing their not being attacked, and making red bars go up. Monking is probably the most mentally challenging character in the game, of course this is just my opinion. An arguement can be made for all classes.

Yunas Ele · Oct 30, 2006, 11:35 PM // 23:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by A User Name

So I'm a bad player because I play in RA when I'm bored and no GvG is going on

He never said you were bad, he said RA monking was easy. You can still be good at something thats easy, no need to jump to conclusions.

Edit: Nvm Shiz beat me to this post by a few mins zzz

A User Name · Oct 30, 2006, 11:45 PM // 23:45

Well he said,

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thom Bangalter

RA monking is easy because everyone that plays there is bad.

so not playing a monk all the time would mean eventually I would be one of those players that is bad, but hey my bad i prolly read too much into it.

bhavv · Oct 31, 2006, 01:33 AM // 01:33

Hi, I've not read all of this yet, but there are 3 NF monk skills that seem brilliant for use in HA:

Glimmering light - low cost, low cast time, low recharde. Virtually immposible to interupt and with chanelling you can spam it all day.

Light of deliverance - Low cost heal party that affects every member under 75% health for around 80 health. Multiply the heal by party mebbers and healing efficiency gets a new definition.

Zealots Benediction - Firstly I dont understand why this skill is in prot prayers, but it is essentially a WoH which heals for the full amount (up to 190), and returns the 10 energy cost of the skill if used on a target under 50% health. Very very nice for energy management.